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Post by Tom Bowen on Jan 27, 2024 23:55:51 GMT
I find it interesting that before Chippenham away in November, when Spencer had that massive rant on camera, we scored four at home back to back and were fourth place in the table. After that - dreadful - 2-1 defeat, we slid down to tenth and that was the beginning of what seems to me to be a broken dressing room. That may not be the case, but I don't think it's a coincidence that we gained points from 12/15 prior to the Chippenham game, and after the manager publicly slates the team in such a manner, we then go on to win 3/14, one of which was a penalty and one was in the 94th minute.
When you lose a dressing room (and I don't mean the location), it's hard to get it back. Yes, we may have had some bad away form, but we were looking up in hope of the playoffs. Now, the way I see it, the Chippenham rant was the beginning of a slippery slope and the ending could be a Southern Prem tour again.
Tricky time ahead.
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Post by msgribbin on Jan 28, 2024 14:15:24 GMT
Possibly you have a point but we could also look at it another way
We've never hit our stride convincingly this season, a handful of good performances but punctuated with some very poor showings, especially away. There's been a lot of fan criticism/disappointment and certainly a need for the club to confront the issues. If Spencer came out and straight batted the post-match interview time and again after poor results, in service of keeping things in-house.....I think he'd be heavily criticised for that as well.
I've got no inside track on any of this stuff and maybe the dressing room has gone. But I also think there are other clear reasons for what we're seeing.
The summer recruitment didn't work. I was quite excited about the signings - aside from Partington who I saw turning in bloody awful performances for Aldershot a few times last season - but basically none have worked out. Apart from Joe, I can't see there were other red flags for those players. Sometimes things just don't work out. No manager has success with every signing, Spencer was rolling the dice to grow the club...didn't work but I don't hold that against him. The full back situation was one we should have avoided, if at all possible though.
Anyhow Spencer has been commendably decisive in first of all challenging and then shipping out the under-performers. These are seasoned players, they can't complain about consequences of poor performances. As an aside, I do feel very sorry for sportspeople - very few of us could live our working lives with our every mistake under the minute scrutiny of hundreds of strangers - but hard as it is, that's the reality.
But the consequence has then been endless chopping and changing, loans parachuting in, an ever changing squad and an unsettled team. All greatly worsened by constant injuries. I see a lack of cohesion and sometimes confidence, I see players unfamiliar with one another and sticking to basic patterns of play. I'm not sure I've seen a lack of commitment or spirit - not beyond one or two who gave off disinterested body language but unfair to name names - but I have seen a team that's struggling to come together as a team.
I can't say whether any of this could have been resolved behind closed doors, I doubt it is all. I think the scale of the problem with the under-performing marquee signings was too great really - personally I think Spencer was right to move folk on, even though it has disrupted the team. I don't think we'd be any better if he hadn't made the changes.
Sometimes truths have to be acknowledged to the fans too, I don't think that's wrong in itself. Maybe Spencer's gone a little far in the post-match emotion at times - there was no need to dig out Cullen yesterday as someone here said - but if the truth loses you the dressing room, then maybe that's a sign the dressing room has to change....
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Post by borobob on Jan 28, 2024 23:13:47 GMT
Some very good points made there msgribbin, and some serious soul searching needed in many areas, playing and Management.
I don't believe for one minute that any player goes on to the field, and doesn't want to try and play, that is a recipe for injury!! But the body language of some of them speaks volumes, and when confidence is low, they need lifting, not lambasting in public!!
If lambasting is needed, and it isn't always!, it is done in the dressing room, and not in a forum, open to the world!!
We have some very talented players in our squad, and we do have the ability to climb upwards, but is the willingness there to perform to their best? How many of them would 'run through brick walls' as they say, for a Manager that openly slates them off, in a public forum?
How would you feel if your boss did it to you? You are going to bust a gut yeah? Yeah, I thought so!!
Spencer has some excellent contacts, and has brought us so many really good players, but I think the crux of the matter is once he has them he doesn't really know how to handle them, even though he now has three coaches to assist!!
All the coaching manuals in the world don't cover 'man management'!!
The dump that lot and start again system (revolving door) and system changes does nothing for team harmony or consistency, and yes I know injuries have savaged us this year, and forced changes, which hasn't helped.
Also there has to be a question mark on some signings, particularly the summer quartet, and players that appear to be injury prone. Makes you wonder why some clubs are happy to let players leave?, particularly dropping down a level or two!
As I posted earlier, last Saturday the three teams above us all won, three of the bottom four all won, and the teams in between us and the bottom four all have games in hand and could, quite easily, overtake us if we aren't careful!!
This Saturday, Dartford at home is probably the most crucial game of the season!! Get that wrong and we are looking right down the barrel of Southern League South again!!
I'm sure no one wants that, but it is a reality! I just hope that the players can be lifted enough, that we have the staff to do it, and that we can get the points to relieve the pressure a little.
Dartford won't roll over easily for sure, but we have to be focussed at ALL levels, to beat them!
COME ON YOU YELLOWWSSAA!!
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Post by armchairarry on Jan 29, 2024 9:17:43 GMT
Possibly you have a point but we could also look at it another way We've never hit our stride convincingly this season, a handful of good performances but punctuated with some very poor showings, especially away. There's been a lot of fan criticism/disappointment and certainly a need for the club to confront the issues. If Spencer came out and straight batted the post-match interview time and again after poor results, in service of keeping things in-house.....I think he'd be heavily criticised for that as well. I've got no inside track on any of this stuff and maybe the dressing room has gone. But I also think there are other clear reasons for what we're seeing. The summer recruitment didn't work. I was quite excited about the signings - aside from Partington who I saw turning in bloody awful performances for Aldershot a few times last season - but basically none have worked out. Apart from Joe, I can't see there were other red flags for those players. Sometimes things just don't work out. No manager has success with every signing, Spencer was rolling the dice to grow the club...didn't work but I don't hold that against him. The full back situation was one we should have avoided, if at all possible though. Anyhow Spencer has been commendably decisive in first of all challenging and then shipping out the under-performers. These are seasoned players, they can't complain about consequences of poor performances. As an aside, I do feel very sorry for sportspeople - very few of us could live our working lives with our every mistake under the minute scrutiny of hundreds of strangers - but hard as it is, that's the reality. But the consequence has then been endless chopping and changing, loans parachuting in, an ever changing squad and an unsettled team. All greatly worsened by constant injuries. I see a lack of cohesion and sometimes confidence, I see players unfamiliar with one another and sticking to basic patterns of play. I'm not sure I've seen a lack of commitment or spirit - not beyond one or two who gave off disinterested body language but unfair to name names - but I have seen a team that's struggling to come together as a team. I can't say whether any of this could have been resolved behind closed doors, I doubt it is all. I think the scale of the problem with the under-performing marquee signings was too great really - personally I think Spencer was right to move folk on, even though it has disrupted the team. I don't think we'd be any better if he hadn't made the changes. Sometimes truths have to be acknowledged to the fans too, I don't think that's wrong in itself. Maybe Spencer's gone a little far in the post-match emotion at times - there was no need to dig out Cullen yesterday as someone here said - but if the truth loses you the dressing room, then maybe that's a sign the dressing room has to change.... Alongside the criticism on Connor being harsh on him, SD needs to look at the bigger picture. We have the 6th best goalscoring record in the league despite not having a forward who is setting the world on fire. Yet we have the 5th worst defence, and in 10 from the last 12 league games have conceded 2 or more goals! Someone needs to take control of our shape out of possession and sort out the defensive issue - that is what is sending us freefalling down the table, not our forwards putting one over the bar! |
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shaun
1st team regular
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Post by shaun on Jan 29, 2024 18:43:48 GMT
Possibly you have a point but we could also look at it another way We've never hit our stride convincingly this season, a handful of good performances but punctuated with some very poor showings, especially away. There's been a lot of fan criticism/disappointment and certainly a need for the club to confront the issues. If Spencer came out and straight batted the post-match interview time and again after poor results, in service of keeping things in-house.....I think he'd be heavily criticised for that as well. I've got no inside track on any of this stuff and maybe the dressing room has gone. But I also think there are other clear reasons for what we're seeing. The summer recruitment didn't work. I was quite excited about the signings - aside from Partington who I saw turning in bloody awful performances for Aldershot a few times last season - but basically none have worked out. Apart from Joe, I can't see there were other red flags for those players. Sometimes things just don't work out. No manager has success with every signing, Spencer was rolling the dice to grow the club...didn't work but I don't hold that against him. The full back situation was one we should have avoided, if at all possible though. Anyhow Spencer has been commendably decisive in first of all challenging and then shipping out the under-performers. These are seasoned players, they can't complain about consequences of poor performances. As an aside, I do feel very sorry for sportspeople - very few of us could live our working lives with our every mistake under the minute scrutiny of hundreds of strangers - but hard as it is, that's the reality. But the consequence has then been endless chopping and changing, loans parachuting in, an ever changing squad and an unsettled team. All greatly worsened by constant injuries. I see a lack of cohesion and sometimes confidence, I see players unfamiliar with one another and sticking to basic patterns of play. I'm not sure I've seen a lack of commitment or spirit - not beyond one or two who gave off disinterested body language but unfair to name names - but I have seen a team that's struggling to come together as a team. I can't say whether any of this could have been resolved behind closed doors, I doubt it is all. I think the scale of the problem with the under-performing marquee signings was too great really - personally I think Spencer was right to move folk on, even though it has disrupted the team. I don't think we'd be any better if he hadn't made the changes. Sometimes truths have to be acknowledged to the fans too, I don't think that's wrong in itself. Maybe Spencer's gone a little far in the post-match emotion at times - there was no need to dig out Cullen yesterday as someone here said - but if the truth loses you the dressing room, then maybe that's a sign the dressing room has to change.... Alongside the criticism on Connor being harsh on him, SD needs to look at the bigger picture. We have the 6th best goalscoring record in the league despite not having a forward who is setting the world on fire. Yet we have the 5th worst defence, and in 10 from the last 12 league games have conceded 2 or more goals! Someone needs to take control of our shape out of possession and sort out the defensive issue - that is what is sending us freefalling down the table, not our forwards putting one over the bar! A frustrating season so far. Agree with the last paragraph above JT is player of the season already in my view.The 1 nil home win against Braintree for example we were awful but Jack made save after save. Going as far back to the FA cup loss to WSM we were just as bad and would have lost by more without JT. Injuries have played a big part this season contributing to the lack of consistency.Folivi,JNW,Ricky etc.Pavey never seemed fully match fit despite his goals. Ryan Upward was always playing catch up fitness wise.10 years at Maidenhead I don't think we saw the best of him. The right wing/back seems to have been a problem from the start.When they signed Ben Mason I thought great,a chance to change the formation and see Reggie and Selim taking the game to the opposition.The latter didn't win player of the season for his defensive play.Unfortunately Ben gets crocked. A soft underbelly?I think that's unfair.Plenty of fight in the current squad and staff to get us through this bad patch. |
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Post by jumaiton on Jan 30, 2024 12:02:36 GMT
Some very good points made there msgribbin, and some serious soul searching needed in many areas, playing and Management. I don't believe for one minute that any player goes on to the field, and doesn't want to try and play, that is a recipe for injury!! But the body language of some of them speaks volumes, and when confidence is low, they need lifting, not lambasting in public!! If lambasting is needed, and it isn't always!, it is done in the dressing room, and not in a forum, open to the world!! We have some very talented players in our squad, and we do have the ability to climb upwards, but is the willingness there to perform to their best? How many of them would 'run through brick walls' as they say, for a Manager that openly slates them off, in a public forum? How would you feel if your boss did it to you? You are going to bust a gut yeah? Yeah, I thought so!! Spencer has some excellent contacts, and has brought us so many really good players, but I think the crux of the matter is once he has them he doesn't really know how to handle them, even though he now has three coaches to assist!! All the coaching manuals in the world don't cover 'man management'!! The dump that lot and start again system (revolving door) and system changes does nothing for team harmony or consistency, and yes I know injuries have savaged us this year, and forced changes, which hasn't helped. Also there has to be a question mark on some signings, particularly the summer quartet, and players that appear to be injury prone. Makes you wonder why some clubs are happy to let players leave?, particularly dropping down a level or two! As I posted earlier, last Saturday the three teams above us all won, three of the bottom four all won, and the teams in between us and the bottom four all have games in hand and could, quite easily, overtake us if we aren't careful!! This Saturday, Dartford at home is probably the most crucial game of the season!! Get that wrong and we are looking right down the barrel of Southern League South again!! I'm sure no one wants that, but it is a reality! I just hope that the players can be lifted enough, that we have the staff to do it, and that we can get the points to relieve the pressure a little. Dartford won't roll over easily for sure, but we have to be focussed at ALL levels, to beat them! COME ON YOU YELLOWWSSAA!! Agree 100% |
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Post by northlondonboro on Jan 30, 2024 14:51:55 GMT
"Selim taking the game to the opposition.The latter didn't win player of the season for his defensive play."
Great point and, to be fair to Spencer, he does hold his hands up about the penalty award on Saturday. But again, it comes back to not learning from previous mistakes and insisting on playing 3 at the back. Against St. Albans and then Eastbourne Selim gives away a pen because wing-back isn't his position and we lose 2-1. Admittedly, maybe some refs wouldn't have given both of them, but I really hope the same thing doesn't happen a third time.
Aside from tactics, and in terms of this season's atrocious away results (again), when you're away and don't have your own fans cheering you on every side is susceptible to losing with a whimper. Especially if they haven't had the right mentality instilled into them by the manager.
Personally, I think we'll pick up enough points at home to be safe, but a bottom half finish with the players we've got is not a positive advertisement for the coaching staff*, I'm afraid.
*I meant management tactics more than coaching, apologies Bob!
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Post by borobob on Jan 30, 2024 15:36:31 GMT
but a bottom half finish with the players we've got is not a positive advertisement for the coaching staff, I'm afraid.
That's a tad unfair, coaches may coach and advise the players, but may, possibly?, not be involved too closely with the final decisions re tactics and formations on match days!!
I too think we may just have enough to pull us clear of the murky depths, but we have to be very aware!!
Half way finish for the season would be ok, but a little disappointing from the early speculations at the start of the season, but that's where we are!
Following from an earlier comment, the NL looks absolutely terrifying with the standards of Clubs and the professionalism they possess. We are so, so, far from competing at that level just yet, so NLS would be ok for a few years, as long as we build the club, on an and off the field while we do it! Off the field things look pretty good, and we just need to sort out the playing side, that's where it all starts, everything follows from that!
We just need to consolidate for a while!!
COME ON YOU YELLOWWSSAA!!
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Post by Tom Bowen on Jan 30, 2024 16:08:32 GMT
but a bottom half finish with the players we've got is not a positive advertisement for the coaching staff, I'm afraid.That's a tad unfair, coaches may coach and advise the players, but may, possibly?, not be involved too closely with the final decisions re tactics and formations on match days!! I too think we may just have enough to pull us clear of the murky depths, but we have to be very aware!!Half way finish for the season would be ok, but a little disappointing from the early speculations at the start of the season, but that's where we are! Following from an earlier comment, the NL looks absolutely terrifying with the standards of Clubs and the professionalism they possess. We are so, so, far from competing at that level just yet, so NLS would be ok for a few years, as long as we build the club, on an and off the field while we do it! Off the field things look pretty good, and we just need to sort out the playing side, that's where it all starts, everything follows from that! We just need to consolidate for a while!! COME ON YOU YELLOWWSSAA!! The signings that we make also need to keep up with the competition. The top level of "non-league" containing teams with monstrous budgets compared to us and others at this level means that, inevitably, some will drop down to Step 2, which we have started to see with Yeovil, Torquay, Maidstone etc (who will probably have an enormous budget next season with the money from their cup run at the moment, particularly if they don't go up). I'm happy with National League South. It gives us a better advantage in the cup competitions and puts on the map more than it would if we were Step 3 or below. I just hope the transfer policy in future is not "He's an NL player let's get him and then later realise that he isn't 100% enthusiastic about it" as I don't want the NLS to become a care home for pro players. |
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